The Wholesale Forums
 
 
 
Home  |  Register  |  Members  |  Today’s Posts  |  New Posts  |  Calendar
Welcome to the The Wholesale Forums. All times are GMT +1. The time now is 06:31 PM.

Old 28-05-2007, 09:06 PM   3 links from elsewhere to this Post. Click to view. #1 (permalink)
greedyboy
Community Advertiser
 
greedyboy's Avatar
greedyboy is online now

Join Date: May 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 2,397
iTrader: (15)

Default Dealing with The Chinese

DEALING WITH THE CHINESE

There is a popular misconception that a majority of Chinese sellers are scammers. I am going to try and expel this myth with my experience and my little knowledge. I do not claim to be an expert on international trade but I can share my experiences and hope some of this information will of help to someone out there!

THE GOOD OLD DAYS

This makes me sound old! I am probably not much older or younger than most users here. Now in these good old days there was no internet as such, that came a few years later. You would do all your business by phone, a fax machine and a (borrowed in my case) Global Sources publication which back then really was a bible. Some people really do not know how lucky they are now, you have everything at the end of your broadband connection!

With a little bit of courage I started importing at a young age from my bedroom in my parent house. My very first product was a mobile phone battery. Not an ordinary one though. It was a NiCad battery (all batteries were NiCad 12 years ago). NiCad batteries suffered from ‘Memory Effect’ whereby the more you charged them the less charge they held between charging cycles.

This battery I found had a built-in discharger! But not only that, it also had a ‘test button’ which when pressed would light up a series of LED’s which would let you know how much charge was remaining. The standby was also increased as they were rated at 1800mah instead of the usual 800 – 1200 mah.

To cut a long story short. I blagged 30 batteries from a Taiwanese factory (MOQ 1000pcs per model) launched them into the UK and sold them retail/wholesale (as I was in that business at the time). I got quite a lot of exposure thanks to my marketing abilities and they even were awarded ‘What Cellphone Award of Excellence’ (a mobile magazine at the time).

I went on to import and sell many of these and ultimately handed the product over to a big distributor, but to my peril I only earned 10% of what I should have due to my own fault and little knowlwdge of distruting agreements. However they went bust in a big way about 7 years ago (people in the mobile industry will know who there were) so that was a small consolation.

Updated: A quick search and I'm amazed I found a copy of the actual published review from 1996!

WHY TAIWAN AND NOT CHINA?

It was not uncommon at that time as anything technology/electrical/computer related was produced in Taiwan as the Chinese were famous for poor quality elecronics (to my knowledge plastic and textile products was their speciality at that time).

To get round this and to increase credability many Chinese factories manufactured electronics, shiped the components to Taiwan and assembled them in a third party factory just so they could put ‘Made in Taiwan on them! You still will find much higher quality electronics in Taiwan to this day, but China will offer a similar product cheaper. You make the choice!

CHINESE BUSINESS MEN/WOMEN

They are not all scammers. You build a working relationship with one and you have a friend for life. I personally have visited factories and the owner or senior manager would put me up in his own house with his family. They are offended if you stay in a hotel. Now tell me they are scammers? If you could smoke on flights I would visit China more regular .

Fortunately I am now in a position where I have people in China who can audit new suppliers by visiting factories and send me back a report a few days later. Only last Saturday (26 May) I had an audit arranged on a new factory and will publish some the actual photographs taken (for confidential reasons I can not post the actual report).

HOW IT WORKS

As my experince tends to be involved around consumer electronics my experience is that you have 4 types of supplier in China. The factory, the trader, the broker and the scammer. Obviously you are best to deal with a factory. The higher up the food chain the better your chances of lasting. Tip: the higher the MOQ (1000pcs is not uncommon) usually the better quality the item produced.

FACTORIES: Factories (or could be classed a s a manufacturer) produce the final product and normally have a strict MOQ of 100/500/1000pcs of each item.

Although they are a factory/manufacturer they do not necessary produce all the components. It is very common they at least they will produce the main circuit boards using a SMT Machine (Surface Mount Technology). Even the main electronics could have been designed by someone else and they just replicate it (sometimes under licensce and sometimes not!).

They have rows upon rows of production lines where humans assemble every part until you have the finished packaged product. Much the same way cars are manufactured. Usually, cases and other plastic parts will be bought in from a case manufacturer. Stickers will be purchased from a printer. The packaging will be bought from another printer and so on. The bigger the factory, the more components they produce in-house.

You will have noticed this with generic MP3 players for exmple. They tend to look all the same because the factories have all purchased the casing from another factory that just produces plastic components. To make a simple plastic MP3 player casing can cost £20,000 or more just in development and tooling (essentially the mould to make the cases from) design and CAD costs and that is before you have actually produces a single platic case or component!

So to keep costs down, the factories buy cases and other plastic components in from another factory for a few cents each. A saving upwards of US$250,000 on injection moulding machines, staff, design tools and tooling costs.

TRADERS: Tend to deal in much lower MOQ 100pcs is common and tends to be more flexable. They will either purchase 1000pcs from the factory and then break them up into smaller MOQ. This is not a bad thing as they will physically house their stock. Be aware that a lot of traders pretend to be a factory and will display photos of a production line and certificates on their website etc.

BROKERS: Will not hold any stock and will purchase as per your order, sometimes gambling using your money. The same applies, they may pretend to be a factory also.

SCAMMERS:
Goodbye money! Yes there are scammers in China. Do you realise when you T/T US $1800 to a person you have never met before that is the equivalent to a YEARS SALARY to the average Chinese factory worker!?!? Can you imagine someone T/Ting you £20K? It amounts to the same thing! Becareful, no one is safe. I admit I have lost a few dollars over the years, but to-date they have only been a small amount 'gamble money' as I had a feeling something was not right. Gut feeling accounts for a lot in suppliers, buying and selling.

THINK OUTSIDE OF THE BOX - USE CHINA TO YOUR ADVANTAGE

At the time of my first international experience I had a much older friend who owned a massive mail order computer business. He had been importing for years. One of his greatest achievements in my opinion was a mouse. What he did was pure genius.

He went to a Chinese manufacturer, bought a basic 50p mouse, put his logo/brand on it, bundled it with some OEM paint programs, put it in a very well designed and attractive packaging all for around £3.00. They were sold into distributors and ultimately could be bought in Dixons, Argos or any other high street retailer for £34.99. To me personally, that is what importing from China is about, not looking for branded electronics and trying to squeeze 10% margin!!!!

Tip 1: If you wish to sell electronics directly to retailers they expect to work on a 40% margin.

Tip 2: If you wish to sell directly to big retailers/high street you will have to sell to a distributor who supplies the big retailers. They expect to work on a 20% margin.

Tip 3: When working out Retail prices remember they will include VAT @ 17.5% so work backwards when establishing your lowest selling price.

PICTURES FROM A REAL FACTORY

As mentioned earlier in this article, I recently had our China based agents perform a Factory Audit on potential manufacturer in Shenzhen. This is a typical 'larger' style factory which would have a MOQ of 1000+ pcs of each item and mass produce electrical items and of a high standard. So much so, well known brand name products you would find in the high street would be manufactured here on an OEM basis.

I hope these photographs give you an idea of what and where your products are made:

Links to the other photographs:

Reception and Showroom

Production Line(s)

SMT Machine Room (Surface Mount Technology)

RoHS Tesing Machine

Vibration Testing Machine

Salt Spray Testing Machine


Age Test Room

Also a big thank you to Anthony for hosting these pics!

Last edited by greedyboy : 31-05-2007 at 11:10 AM.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
 
Old 28-05-2007, 10:54 PM   #2 (permalink)
Anthony
Community Administrator
 
Anthony's Avatar
Anthony is offline

Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: UK
Posts: 8,668
iTrader: (8)

Default

This is without a doubt one of the best articles ever written for this forum.

Thank you sharing!
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
 
Old 28-05-2007, 11:01 PM   #3 (permalink)
greedyboy
Community Advertiser
 
greedyboy's Avatar
greedyboy is online now

Join Date: May 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 2,397
iTrader: (15)

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony View Post
This is without a doubt one of the best articles ever written for this forum.

Thank you sharing!
Thank you Anthony (the cheque is in the post)!

It is still a 'work in progress' and being updated constantly.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
 
Old 28-05-2007, 11:16 PM   #4 (permalink)
Boro97
Community Members
 
Boro97's Avatar
Boro97 is offline

Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: England
Posts: 2,356
iTrader: (4)

Default

Hell of a post did you watch brit millionaires in china earlier tonight ,
__________________

Designer Clothes & Sunglasses
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
 
The Wholesale Forums - Business Article Competition - Submit yours now!
Old 28-05-2007, 11:22 PM   #5 (permalink)
greedyboy
Community Advertiser
 
greedyboy's Avatar
greedyboy is online now

Join Date: May 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 2,397
iTrader: (15)

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boro97 View Post
Hell of a post did you watch brit millionaires in china earlier tonight ,
Yes I did see it, had to stop writing this article so I didn't miss it! To be honest the antisipation of watching it inspired me to start writing this articlelast night
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
 
Old 29-05-2007, 12:35 AM   #6 (permalink)
JPB
Community Member
 
JPB's Avatar
JPB is offline

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Ireland
Posts: 1,263
iTrader: (0)

Default

Amazing post congrats and thanks for sharing

You must be very smart being able to write all that

Cheers again,

James
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
 
Old 29-05-2007, 02:34 AM   #7 (permalink)
Titchimp
Community Member
 
Titchimp's Avatar
Titchimp is offline

Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Milton Keynes, UK
Posts: 1,290
iTrader: (1)

Default

what a great read!
__________________
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
 
Old 29-05-2007, 09:53 AM   #8 (permalink)
Mainkey
Community Member
 
Mainkey is offline

Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 143
iTrader: (0)

Default

Very nice. Also improved my English reading skill
__________________
Welcome to Lithuania.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
 
Old 29-05-2007, 10:38 AM   #9 (permalink)
Ash_mk
Community Member
 
Ash_mk's Avatar
Ash_mk is offline

Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Milton Keynes, UK
Posts: 163
iTrader: (0)

Default

Great read. I caught a bit of that program on C4 last night but my missus was watching Oceans 11 on ITV and i just flicked over on the ad break. I saw that bathroom guy whos always on watchdog. He cracks me up. ' More expensive than the great wall of china' LOL
__________________
Ash
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
 
Old 29-05-2007, 12:44 PM   #10 (permalink)
Mac1205
Community Member
 
Mac1205's Avatar
Mac1205 is offline

Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 594
iTrader: (0)

Default

Thanks for sharing . Quality read.
__________________
http://www.world-importing.com -Further yourself and your business learn about what you need to know inside importing.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
 
Reply


LinkBacks (?)
LinkBack to this Thread: http://www.thewholesaleforums.co.uk/forum/business-articles-and-resources/13708-dealing-chinese.html
Posted By For Type Date
Sourcing from China? Good or bad experiences? - UK Business Forums This thread Refback 04-09-2007 05:06 PM
Sourcing from China? Good or bad experiences? - UK Business Forums This thread Refback 03-09-2007 04:01 PM
Sourcing from China? Good or bad experiences? - UK Business Forums This thread Refback 03-09-2007 11:37 AM

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
How to self-check your Chinese suppliers... Businessinchina Business Articles and Resources 5 20-06-2008 02:55 AM
Chinese Draggon Boat Festival cbeebies Off Topic Chat 0 12-06-2008 02:27 AM
Verifying Chinese Company donsrno1 Supplier Discussion 8 13-11-2007 02:46 PM