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Threads being closed for discussing sensitive issues

Discussion in 'Forum Support & Feedback' started by Volantary, Sep 8, 2012.

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  1. Gary

    Gary

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2009
    Messages:
    16,364
    Why would moderation guides be in the terms?

    In response yes if they believe there to be good reason, and again, if the op, or anyone else involved wishes to appeal then it is best to contact the mod (if they haven't contacted you or posted a reason on the thread), and if you're still not satisfied then contact staff, or if you don't know who closed the thread just contact staff in the first place with a link to the thread in question, a closed thread takes seconds to re-open if they see fit.
  2. WDMR

    WDMR

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2011
    Messages:
    372
    Closing this thread would have been a poor move. I can assure you a much angrier thread would have been created soon afterwards.
  3. Gary

    Gary

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2009
    Messages:
    16,364
    It may have been considered a poor move but it would have been the right move considering where it ended up (and was obviously going to), but again, I wasn't going to close the thread as it's about me, and to be honest, an angrier one may have been opened but then the right thing would have been to have closed that too as soon as that got personal (which wouldn't have taken long), and so on.

    It needs to be remembered that a very small proportion of members do not run the forums, Anthony and the staff do with the help and support of voluntary mods.
  4. Just Browsing

    Just Browsing Banned Member

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2010
    Messages:
    819
    With all due respect it needs to be remembered that without members this forum would be nothing, and also I would say that the members who have posted in this thread are probably responsible for 80% of the content in this forum.
    I know exactly where this thread is going to end up, Anthony(as usual) will post a long rambling post about this that and the other and then close the thread. Lets face it even he cannot be really arsed to post anymore.
    Anyway without the members who have posted in this thread this forum would be dead, Im sure that Anthony will be able to answer all the questions and keep the forum running all by himself?? NOPE.
    I have also been surprised to see that both Lace and Jennilee have both been on tonight and not one of them have bothered to do anything with this thread.
  5. Lace

    Lace Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2011
    Messages:
    2,057
    Hi everyone,

    Sorry for not having posted sooner, TWF staff are unavailable during weekends. This is just one of the many reasons why we considered getting voluntary moderators apart from being recommended by some members on this thread. We agreed to trial this and make it permanent depending on everyone's feedback.

    I just have to mention we really appreciate the efforts and time generously given to us by Vicky, Gary, Dave and Andy in helping keep the forum together.

    Likewise, we appreciate everyone's feedback and I've enlisted some points for Anthony to consider.

    To clarify some of the issues raised here:

    1. Protocol on discussions touching on sensitive topics such as religion, race, and politics

    We follow Anthony's lead on this to close threads that are bordering on being racist or discriminatory. Hence, members are discouraged to post anything specifically about religion, race, and politics with the view of the community respectful of eachother's differences.

    Some of you have recommended we open a sub-forum where we can all discuss these topics freely as adults and I will put this forward for Anthony's consideration. Note though that we already have an existing lounge section.

    2. When do moderators close threads

    We close threads when discussions are getting off-topic but upon evaluation think replies deserve to remain published for future reference.

    We close threads when an older discussion crops up (because it is replied to) but more updated discussions are available or it is better for the member to start a new and much more up to date discussion.

    3. Updates to the Forum Terms

    This has come up a number of times and we are taking action by publishing a more friendly, easy to understand version that is more accessible to anyone. The document is currently under careful review to make sure we have all possible grounds covered.

    Noted that the current forum terms do not cover discussions on race, religion, and politics. I personally think this is for the very same reasons many of you stated, that it will blanket cover plenty of discussions that touch on these topics but are not necessarily discriminatory. As an example, discussions on Trading with China, Dealing with Chinese Suppliers, etc.

    Hence, at the moment it rests upon the moderator's sole discretion if a thread needs to be closed.

    4. iPhone 5 thread

    Gary made the right decision here as we simply cannot allow a supplier to promise availability of stock that doesn't even exist in the open market.

    Please note that Gary did not remove the thread but Jenilee did upon receiving Anthony's instructions.

    5. Concerns with moderator discretion and actions

    If anyone is concerned with the above, you can send a PM directly to the moderator and include team TWF in your conversation (me or Jenilee). As an example, you think your thread shouldn't have been closed or you think your post should not be removed.

    Likewise, you can post your concerns or questions on the Forum Support & Feedback section

    6. Moderators having an opinion

    Quiet hard for me to comment on this but we have never been instructed not to voice out our opinions on discussions we take part in. Afterall, we would sound like robots if we did not have our own opinions or personality.

    I think the keyword here is that we need to remain impartial in implementing the forum terms. This simply means that the forum terms should apply to all or none at all.

    Personally (and I am stating an opinion), I think Gary was right to close threads that were starting to become off-topic with the discussion of race, and it being a delicate topic.

    However, please know we are considering everyone's feedback here with the view of improving our community for everyone.

    Thank you,
    Lace
  6. Lace

    Lace Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2011
    Messages:
    2,057
    Was just back reading 8 pages and listing everyone's recommendations. I think I better get speed reading skills! x.x
  7. Just Browsing

    Just Browsing Banned Member

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2010
    Messages:
    819
    That kind of contradicts itself,
    Firstly, members either are discouraged or forbidden from discussing these subjects??
    Secondly, you speak of a sub forum where we can discuss these things openly, yet then you mention we already have a lounge section, so are we allowed to discuss these topics in there?
    Just my input but not being able to discuss politics is ridiculous, this is Britain not North Korea
  8. Lace

    Lace Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2011
    Messages:
    2,057
    Thanks for pointing that out, would this example illustrate this better?

    not allowed - Catholicism, Buddhism, etc - which is the best religion?
    not allowed - All Nigerians are scammers

    The following examples will need the moderator's discretion

    Do you sell to Italy and have you been scammed by Italians?
    Scammed by Nigerian seller

    Also wanted to point this out:
    Re: Lounge, the above illustrations apply here and should help everyone what can and cannot be discussed.

    Re: Sub forum, what I meant was I am putting this forward as a suggestion to Anthony as a place where members can discuss topics under those 'not allowed'. I hope that made sense?

    Re: politics, noted your feedback on this Just Browsing. I see other forums having a sub forum or section called 'Just Politics' so maybe we can have that too. What do you guys think? Looking forward to everyone's input.
  9. andrew page

    andrew page

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2012
    Messages:
    644
    there is no harm with sub forums providing it is just debate and not turn to hatred it may be a good idea to have a warning

    current climate for immigrants working is a big area right now current government policies yes some members will disagree thats life

    you can please some of the people some of the time but never all the people all of the time

    to be honest this thread has been appalling why have adults been behaving like babies honestly i expected better

    let the moderators do their job mistakes can happen let it slide now guys move on more time you spend focussing on this thread the more time your not devoting to your business which means money lost

    on a sub note to the owners i am bemused why you dont keep an eye out even on off days running a business is 7 days a week not 5 this is online and constant 24/7 7 days a week not a dig btw its things like this what need attention and quicker intervention sometimes

    to everyone we only live once live it don't waste your precious time on stupid arguements like this!!!!!!
  10. Gary

    Gary

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2009
    Messages:
    16,364
    What I was talking about was the same several members that really have little to say unless it's disruptive 80 - 90% of the time, massive difference as all they generally do is make the forum a worse place to be, to the point where yet another long standing member has decided to leave the forum who wasn't even partaking in this thread but based on the actions of the same few people who have done it all before and will again, several members are always at the centre of such discussions / witch hunts so why would Anthony be by himself?

    A very small percentage of members have voiced their opionions (repeatedly) here, and out of many others who have, they have at least seen reason / agreed to disagree and move on with their day, they aren't the ones always dragging things down, they aren't the ones making massive issues where there aren't any, out of these 150 posts the majority were unnecessary and completely uncalled for.


    And sorry Lace but you're saying there's a right place for a MOD (or anyone else) public witch hunt? To be honest I'm disgusted by that sentence, jsut for the fact that the several members I am, and have referenced are incabably of accepting answers and have proven to be so.

    How about a mention on that? or the level of how personal such threads (including this), have become? yet allowed apparently as long at staff discretion, so can we please have a clearer mod guideline that doesn't tell us posts such as this should have been closed agres ago, that personal attacks are indeed allowed, and screw the rules as long as you can keep a small percentage of whiners happy (even though they are chasing members away one minute then whingeing about them being gone the next), sorry but this forum really needs to open it's eyes.

    I understand that what you actually said was 'post your concerns' but surely this proves we shouldn't even HAVE a support and feedback section, because if people cannot accept an answer or difference of opinion without turning it into a 150 post hatefest aginst anyone who has dared to voice an opinion different to their own as to be honest, I I was a noob reading this I seriously wouldn't come back, and that's NOT because I closed a thread or whether or not certain topics could be discussed.

    Surely, the better response would be to either a) contact a member of staff to appeal against a decision, or b) agree to disagree, or possibly even just c) NOTto tur it into a major issue, especially when the thread closed had half a dozen posts.

    Whent the largest thread on the forum for a long time is nothign but a 150 post wich hunt with complaining, arguing, personal attacks and insults the I really believe something needs to be looked at, especially when actual business related threads don't generally get even a quarter of the amount of attention, the negative WILL spread way faster than any positives, that's a guaranteed fact.
  11. Anthony

    Anthony

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2004
    Messages:
    17,274
    Let's all take a breath here. I am putting a stop to this thread now because it has already done enough damage.

    I need time to consider all of this and I want to ask for everyone's patience given this all happened in my absence.
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